Classes/Logs/2012/September/18/01-02

01:16:41 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	Who listened to my last class?
01:17:06 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	First of all.
01:17:59 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	We left off with python functions
01:18:28 *	l0wtech has quit (Client exited)
01:18:38 *	l0wtech ([email protected]) has joined #CSIII
01:19:18 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	http://pastebin.com/3dG6iygw this piece of code
01:20:40 <d4rch0n>	it might be better to start with #!/usr/bin/env python
01:20:58 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	http://pastebin.com/9udApQq9 was the logs
01:21:01 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	Yes, fair
01:21:39 *	alphis has quit (Ping timeout)
01:21:49 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	I guess I should disclaimer myself as not a python god, or god of any matter, and for that I may leave rough edges, but I will do my best, please assist me :)
01:22:54 <d4rch0n>	lol np. me neither, but i'll let you know if i catch anything
01:22:59 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	^^
01:24:48 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	So if I begin from last time, I think we should start explaining lines 5, and 6.
01:25:13 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	Which is the function definition for the 'main' function.
01:26:25 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	Well
01:26:38 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	I should say it is the definition and code body for the main() function
01:26:44 <hatter>	<3
01:26:46 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	the definition being line 5
01:26:51 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	and 6 being the code body
01:27:42 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	we already know what print does and how it concatenates variables, etc, so lets focus more on what is happening with the function it's self.
01:28:26 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	in line 5 we name our function
01:28:30 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	main()
01:29:27 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	and give it the "parameters", or "arguments" 'argument1' and 'argument2', these are a bit ambiguously named, because we will re-use this code to explain several more concepts as we go.
01:29:37 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	by giv
01:29:38 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	give
01:30:09 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	I mean we define that the function accepts two named variables as input, named argument1, and argument2
01:31:23 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	In more technical terms, we introduced those two variables to the 'scope' of the function.
01:32:12 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	So what we have here then is a function that just takes two arguments and prints them on the screen.
01:32:26 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	the next important bit being line 13
01:32:32 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	the call
01:33:33 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	In the line we use our main function, or call it from our code (remember python starts at the beginning of the file and works straight down through the outer layer control structures)
01:33:42 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	this*
01:35:04 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	So on this line we have "passed" our main() function two values, string literal "Hello there" and sys.argv[1] (which is the first command line parameter.)
01:35:53 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	without mentioning the arguments name
01:36:08 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	these are called "positional" arguments
01:37:06 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	as opposed to what's the word "optional" arguments? 
01:37:15 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	Which I will discuss more in a bit.
01:38:31 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	Anyhow that is how we define a function and give it data to work on, but what if we want to get some data back from the function?
01:40:40 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	http://pastebin.com/3cWXPFsC
01:40:59 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	The return statement.
01:41:29 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	With this we can use our functions, not only to operate on data, but to act in the place of data
01:42:10 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	for instance variableContainingAString = main( "rofl" "mao")
01:43:01 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	is valid python in this instance, and variableContainingAString would equal (== in python) "roflmao"
01:43:31 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	This also lends to demonstrating why functions are useful: re-usability.
01:43:43 *	alphis ([email protected]) has joined #CSIII
01:45:20 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	So lets see
01:45:44 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	Ever unprepared, what don't you all now yet...
01:46:00 <hatter>	xD
01:46:06 <hatter>	objects
01:46:21 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	We also introduced type conversion here, which leads to objects
01:47:38 *	rorschach has quit (Ping timeout)
01:47:55 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	the str() function converts an "object" to an object of the type string, it is a python built-in, and is reasonably sane in its implementation,, therfore it is reusable.
01:48:24 *	Tsunami ([email protected]) has joined #CSIII
01:48:35 <e>	hello
01:48:38 <e>	we are talking about python?
01:48:55 <e>	str calls __str__() on the object.
01:48:59 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	any construct in python is an object, meaning a variable is an object, a function is an object, a class, a string literal, a whole python module, they are all treated internally as an 'object' in the modern implementation of python.
01:49:07 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	yes, go e
01:49:22 <e>	ye everything in python is a PyObject 
01:49:44 *	rorschach ([email protected]) has joined #CSIII
01:49:47 <e>	>>> (15).__str__()
01:49:48 <e>	'15'
01:49:56 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	^\
01:50:18 <e>	>>> str().__str__().__str__().__str__()
01:50:18 <e>	''
01:50:20 <e>	ad infinitum
01:50:43 <hatter>	e: how i define my own object/module/class thingamajigger?
01:50:48 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	^ everything is an object, objects have a minimal set of junctionality they are supposed to expose.
01:50:56 <e>	class Name(object): ...
01:50:58 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	fnctionality.
01:51:01 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	wtf
01:51:05 <e>	new style objects inherit the object object.
01:51:22 <hatter>	oh, ok
01:51:26 <moot[GAR]>	Easy, this is a beginner lecture. I don't think we need to get into old/new objects
01:51:29 <moot[GAR]>	just yet
01:51:38 <hatter>	lol I could track it
01:51:39 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	lol
01:51:50 <e>	for most cases, just inherit object.
01:51:51 <moot[GAR]>	We're covering scope and function definitions
01:51:59 <e>	and don't worry about it tbh.
01:52:08 <hatter>	all I know is everything between py 2.4 <-> 3.x broke when porting across versions
01:52:17 <hatter>	Im guessing that has something to do with
01:52:18 <moot[GAR]>	well no fuckin shit
01:52:18 <hatter>	old and new
01:52:19 <hatter>	:P
01:52:24 <moot[GAR]>	2.4 is like 12 years old
01:52:30 <hatter>	Unless you are referring to new()
01:52:38 <e>	__new__
01:52:40 <e>	has to do with metacalsses
01:52:46 <moot[GAR]>	Yeah, don't mess with __new__
01:52:46 <hatter>	ahhhhh k
01:52:49 <e>	u will never need to use them 99.97% of the time
01:52:50 <moot[GAR]>	It's dark vodoo
01:52:51 *	[moot[GAR]] ([email protected]): moot
01:52:51 *	[moot[GAR]] is a registered nick
01:52:51 *	[moot[GAR]] #python #CSIII +#wtfux 
01:52:51 *	[moot[GAR]] allah.irc :BISMILLAH AR RAHMAN AR RAHIM
01:52:51 *	[moot[GAR]] idle 00:00:01, signon: Tue Aug 28 15:17:29
01:52:51 *	[moot[GAR]] End of WHOIS list.
01:52:55 <moot[GAR]>	very dark python magic
01:52:55 <hatter>	lol
01:52:56 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	#python.
01:52:58 <moot[GAR]>	Yes
01:53:02 <moot[GAR]>	Shutting up
01:53:05 <e>	ok let zzzzzZZZZzzz go on
01:53:17 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	No, just plugging
01:53:17 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	lol
01:53:23 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	um
01:53:33 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	I was kinda getting lost 
01:54:00 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	So
01:54:11 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	Point is if you change
01:54:27 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	print main( "Hello there", sys.argv[1] )
01:54:38 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	to print main( 1337: , sys.argv[1] )
01:54:39 <e>	zzzzzZZZZzzz: is this py2.x or 3.x?
01:55:22 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	Haven't really crossed that yet, I suppose we'll just say 3, but that means someone has to make sure i don't mix shit up.
01:55:43 <e>	stick to 2.x imo
01:55:55 <e>	all the good hacker shit is still 2.x compat only
01:56:15 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	tbh, I dunno if we will run into that problem for a bit
01:56:29 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	slow course, atm unless I like, actually write notes
01:56:45 <e>	go on with ur lecture, we'll discuss it later in PM 
01:56:58 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	truth
01:57:11 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	right ok so
01:57:21 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	<zzzzzZZZZzzz> Point is if you change
01:57:21 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	<zzzzzZZZZzzz> print main( "Hello there", sys.argv[1] )
01:57:21 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	<zzzzzZZZZzzz> to print main( 1337: , sys.argv[1] )
01:57:34 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	if we use str() 
01:57:43 <e>	s/://
01:57:53 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	honestly nothing really good happens because print is magic
01:57:56 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	but
01:58:33 <Dwaan>	e: 
01:58:58 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	We convert our integer literal into a string with str() which as e mentioned really just calls .__str__() on the object passed as it's argument.
01:59:08 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	and return the string representation
01:59:17 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	(str() does)
01:59:19 <d4rch0n>	fyi: python3 wont allow print with space
01:59:24 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	i c
01:59:28 <d4rch0n>	print(blah), not print blah
01:59:35 <moot[GAR]>	Let's call this a Python 2 lecture
01:59:44 <moot[GAR]>	and proceed appropriately
01:59:44 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	That actually got me last class
01:59:55 <d4rch0n>	can always invoke script with python -3 $script
02:00:31 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	TL;DR i don't know the difference but all my code runs anyway, because im 12 and what is this
02:01:09 <foo>	^ this
02:01:16 <zzzzzZZZZzzz>	also i think i am cut off?